best breadmaker

brands
Live chat: your chance to question our breadmaker experts
Do you have any questions about breadmakers or recipes? Or would you like some tips on getting the best from your breadmaker? Log on to www.which.co.uk/breadmakerlive on Wednesday 18 May 2011 between 12 noon and 2:30pm and chat live to our panel of experts, including Patrick Moore from More? The Artisan Bakery. If youre not online, dont worry, you wont miss out. Phone with your questions on 01992 822877, between the times above, and well call you back with an answer by Friday 20th April.
We focus on three of the biggest breadmaker brands and highlight their best-performing models

PANASONIC

Which? 2011 member survey: Customer score 85% (2,686*) Reliability score 95% (2,738*) Panasonic breadmakers have always dominated our Best Buy tables, as they make great bread. In recent years the range has comprised two almost identical models (one has additional programs and a fruit and nut dispenser). Now, the range is expanding, with a new model being launched in June. The ultimate bread-making machine, the SDZB-2502, will feature a yeast dispenser a feature not usually seen on breadmakers in the UK. The two existing models are being given a modern white design to replace the old style, and new settings including a jam and compote option. Panasonic models are a great choice if youre an experienced baker, but theyre also good for newcomers. However, they dont have windows, which inquisitive bakers may find frustrating.

MORPHY RICHARDS

Which? 2011 member survey: Customer score 56% (1,052) Reliability score 88% (1,123) Morphy Richards regularly features in our Best Buy tables, although not all models have made the grade. If youre a beginner, this brand is a good place to start, as the controls are simple to use and its easy to get good results. However, our members have highlighted some gripes. For example, the collapsing paddle can leave a hole in the bottom of the loaf, the recipes are measured by volume (in cups) which can be frustrating if youre used to working by weight, and the wet ingredients have to be added first, leaving your measuring cup sticky. If youre used to a Panasonic breadmaker, you may not like the taste of the bread baked in these machines, because the supplied recipes give loaves that tend to be denser and sweeter, however you can try out your own recipes.
Ever since we first started testing breadmakers in 1997, Best Buys have had to make great bread and be easy to use. Those core requirements still remain, but with the help of your feedback, as well as input from our expert baker Patrick Moore of More? The Artisan Bakery, weve revamped our breadmaker testing to make it even more demanding. For instance, we now scrutinise even more closely the texture of the bread and examine how even the crust is. We also
We deduct points for kneading paddles that stick in the loaf

more for you

THE NEW KID IN TOWN We decided to pitch the new Kenwood BM260 against the trusty Best Buy Panasonic SD-257. Find out how the newcomer fared, and whether it made a decent loaf, in our First Look video: www.which.co.uk/breadmakervideos

Lisa Galliers

Breadmakers expert homeeditor@which.co.uk

32 | May 2011

*Sample sizes in brackets
concentrate our testing efforts on the settings you use most often for brown and white bread. Our scrutiny doesnt stop at the loaf, however. Best Buys have to be quiet, as many of you bake overnight. We also deduct points for kneading paddles that stick in the loaf, since we know this is one of your top bugbears. Manufacturers are innovating hard in 2011. Panasonic is launching its Ultimate breadmaker in June, Kenwood has introduced fan-assisted baking and Eco Buttons and Morphy Richards has overhauled its range. Each brand has at least one Best Buy or Worth Considering model, following our new tests, but each has different strengths. Weve listed these on p33-34. Read on for reliability data and customer satisfaction scores, and our overview of the three major brands Panasonic, Morphy Richards and Kenwood. Youll see our fourth Best Buy, from John Lewis, in our table on p34.

expert VIEW

your questions
Members have asked how much energy it takes to make a loaf in a breadmaker. The answer? Around 4p for a brown loaf on a standard program. Youve also asked if you can make bread thats low in sugar and salt. You can but its a trial and error process. Our breadmakers feature at www.which. co.uk/breadmakers includes tips and links to help you try out new recipes, but weve also lined up an artisan baker to answer your questions see Live chat, above right.

SD-257 120

Which? test score 77% Pros A consistently good performer throughout our tests, this breadmaker produces a decent wholemeal loaf and copes well with baking white loaves and seeded packet mixes. Its one of the quieter models weve tested, and comes with a fruit and nut dispenser for baking bread with added ingredients. Cons No viewing window and longer than average programs, but results are worth the wait. Which.co.uk target price 99 Cheapest high street store John Lewis Also available at Argos, Comet, Currys

www.which.co.uk

SD-256 80
Which? test score 74% Pros This model consistently produces great bread, whether you want a wholemeal loaf, white bread or prefer using a seeded packet mix. However, it scores slightly less than its almost identical sibling (left), because the paddle stuck in the bottom of the loaf three times in our tests. Cons No viewing window, longer than average programs, and no automatic dispenser for adding fruit and nuts. Which.co.uk target price 77 Cheapest high street store Comet Also available at Amazon, Argos, Currys

48322 Easy Use 80

Which? test score 72% Pros Simple controls and good test results make this model a Best Buy. Wholemeal bread scored well for appearance and crumb texture. White bread is slightly less even looking, but still satisfactory. The results for packet mixes are excellent. Cons Heavy and no automatic dispenser. Recipes are weighed in cups and wet ingredients need to go in first, so measuring dry ingredients after can be messy. Which.co.uk target price 66 Cheapest high street store Argos Also available at Currys, Robert Dyas, Tesco

48321 Everyday 100

Which? test score 67% Pros Similar to the 48322, but with a sleek touch-control panel, this model is worth considering if you cant find the Easy Use. It bakes a good wholemeal loaf, with an impressive texture. Results using packet mixes are excellent. It makes satisfactory white bread, but we deducted marks because the crust was uneven on some loaves baked. Cons Paddle stuck in the loaf 80% of times. Recipes are measured in cups (not by weight). Theres no automatic dispenser. Which.co.uk target price 91 Cheapest store Argos Also available at Currys

May 2011 | 33

Photography by: STEVE LEE

test lab Breadmakers

in our latest breadmaker tests, we found four best buys costing from 70 to 120

KENWOOD

Which? 2011 member survey: Customer score 60% (389) Reliability score 89% (365) Kenwood has revamped its breadmaker offering for 2011. All the old models are gone, bar its flagship BM450. This is joined by the BM260 and BM366, both of which feature fan-assisted baking, have sleek compact designs, but dont have a fruit and nut dispenser. Kenwood says the added Eco button bakes a loaf in 85 minutes. This speed isnt unusual most breadmakers have rapid-bake settings but Kenwood claims
this one uses less energy. Well be checking this in our lab tests. The only Kenwood breadmaker to be awarded a Best Buy was the BM450, in 2009. However, weve since toughened up our criteria and deduct points for rustic looks, so it now falls just short of a Best Buy. It still makes good bread, and if you care more about taste than looks then its still a good choice. Your reviews of the BM450 are mostly positive, but some of you have reported issues with the kneading paddle, while others arent keen on measuring out wet ingredients first. You can see what our members have said by heading to www.which.co.uk/ BM450customerviews.

bake time

BM450 130
Which? test score 66% Pros This model is a great choice if youre looking for a stylish breadmaker. It makes a good white loaf and a tasty brown loaf, and copes well with seeded packet mixes. It has lots of extra features, such as an internal light, a viewing window and an automatic dispenser. Cons Its big and heavy, and can be tricky to clean. Weve rated it as average for noise, and some people find it tricky to program. Which.co.uk target price 100 Cheapest high street store John Lewis Also available at Argos, Comet, Currys, House of Fraser
Our reliability survey reveals that Kenwood breadmakers are very reliable overall. However, if youve been affected by any issues with a machine, you can contact Kenwood Customer Services on 2333.

Specification

Which? Test Performance
ze si xd xw h e ic Pr ) (
) (% re o sc se st u te f o se ea le d d pa ck u et st ck ix pa m ed ed d se ea y br a e l it e h d w d ea br e it h l w ea m d le a o re h b l w ea m n) le i o :m h r l w (h ma ) r o in n m e r: it h h ( w a ) (g

t h g ei w

) m (c
Panasonic SD-257 Panasonic SD-256 Morphy Richards 48322 John Lewis CBK150JLU Morphy Richards 48321 Kenwood BM450 Morphy Richards 48319 Premium + Russell Hobbs 17887 Tesco Tricity AV1 Swan VB1010 Curry Logik L90BMS10 Morphy Richards 48330 Daily Loaf Breville VBM003 Autobake
37x28x33 37x28x33 33x38x30 31x28x36 33x38x20 32x38x26 33x38x30 30x27x43 33x27x37 31x41x26 33x37x26 22x31x23 29x31x28
6.9 6.5 6.1 5.3 6.7.1 6.6 7.1 6.2 5.3 3.5 4.8
M,L,XL M,L,XL 450, 680, 900 450, 750 450, 680, 900 500,750,1000 450, 680, 900 900,1134,1361 750:900 680, 900 700, 450, 680, 900
4:00 4:00 3:00 3:00 3:00 3:15 3:00 3:30 3:00 3:20 3:00 2:25 3:25
5:00 5:00 3:40 3:40 3:40 4:35 3:40 3:40 3:40 3:40 3:40 3:25 3:48
HHHH HHHH HHHH HHHH HHHH HHH HHHH HHH HHHH HHH HHH HHH HH
HHHH HHHH HHH HHHH HHH HHHH HHH HHHH HHHH HHHH HHHH HH HHH
HHHH HHH HHH HHHH HHH HHHH HHH HHH HHH HHH HH n/a HH
HHHH HHHHH HHHHH 77 HHHH HHHH HHHH HHHHH HHHHH HHHHH HHHH HHHH HHHH HHH HHHH HHHHH 74 HHHH HHHHH 72 HHHH HH HHH HH HH HH H HH HHHH 50 HHHHH 67 HHHH HHH HHHH HHHH HHHH HHHH
HHHH HHHHH HHHH HHHH HHHHH HHHH
extended reviews for all the breadmakers shown here can be accessed on our members website at www.which.co.uk/breadmakers
a Loaf sizes are an estimation of what the finished loaves will weigh based on manufacturers instructions (converted to grams). Panasonic loaf sizes given as M,L & XL.

Using the table

test performance
Wholemeal/white bread Quality of the loaf produced on the standard setting. means a well risen, appetising loaf that looks great and has a good crumb and nice crust. means a loaf that doesnt look as good but has an acceptable texture and taste. is awarded to bread that hasnt risen well, doesnt look great and isnt appetising at all. White delay Quality of loaf produced on the
Customer score & reliability score Taken from our small appliance reliability investigation (Which? April 2011, p16) and based on more than 13,700 owners views. Sample sizes are in brackets next to the percentage score.

Price See p25

delay setting, using the timer facility. We assess the crust, appearance and crumb texture. We sometimes see better results using this setting. Packet mix Quality of loaf produced using a seeded packet bread mix. Stuck paddle The percentage of runs where the kneading paddle stuck in the bottom of the loaf. Its not unusual for the paddle to stick in the bottom of a baked loaf of bread, but we mark down breadmakers where this

is more often the case than not. Ease of use How easy it is to make bread and to keep the breadmaker clean outside and inside. Most bread pans need cleaning by hand. We also include build quality under this rating.
Ignores price and is based on: Performance 65% Ease of use 35%

34 | May 2011

Breadmakers Live Q&A, 18/05/2011: PDF transcript View the event here: http://www.which.co.uk/home-and-garden/kitchen/reviewsns/breadmakers-live-qanda---which-member-exclusive/ 12:00: Kelly Fenn - Which?: Hello everyone! Thanks for joining us and we hope you find the event useful. 12:01: Kelly Fenn - Which?: Please do send in any questions you have around breadmakers and baking! 12:01: Kelly Fenn - Which?: Our team of breadmaking experts are here and gearing up to answer all your questions, so please do start firing away. 12:02: Kelly Fenn - Which?: On our panel today, we have. 12:02: Lisa Galliers - Which?: Hi , I'm Lisa, the Senior Researcher who covers breadmakers. 12:03 Ali Eastwood - Which?: hi everyone I'm Ali Eastwood and I'm a Team Leader in Which?'s Home Team. I've been at Which? for 10 years now and my second ever article was a breadmakers review (rifle through your back issues to May 2001). Since then, I've always taken a close interest in our breadmaker testing as it's evolved over the years - especially when we're testing in the office: the smells are amazing. It's always been evident that breadmakers inspire lots of passion and interest in users so I hope our session today will be a great forum for you to share thoughts and ideas. Look forward to answering your questions! 12:04: Patrick Moore: Hi everyone I am Patrick Moore from The multi-award-winning More? the Artisan Bakery in Staveley, Cumbria. Good afternoon all - hope you enjoy todays live session. 12:06: Lewis Skinner - Which?: Hi everyone, I'm Lewis - the Business Researcher who covers breadmakers. I'll be happy to answer any questions you have on new products and market trends in the world of breadmakers. 12:06: Kelly Fenn - Which?: A quick note on how the Q&A works: all you need to do is type your name and question into the box on the screen below and press 'send'. It won't appear immediately but will join the queue, before being allocated to an expert. 12:06 [Comment From Brian Saunders] Due you think the new panasonic bread maker will be worth waiting for. I don't have a breadmaker at the moment 12:07: Lisa Galliers - Which?: Brian, do you mean the new Panasonic Ultimate bread maker with the yeast dispenser? 12:09 [Comment From Linda Smith] Hi, 12:09: Kelly Fenn - Which?: Hi Linda - we didn't get all of your question, so please do repost! 12:09: [Comment From Brian Saunders] How is it best to store the bread
12:09: Ali Eastwood - Which?: hi Brian Sealing in a plastic bag is a good option, or wrapping the bread in foil usually works well. What have you tried? In my experience, my bread usually disappears pretty quickly so I haven't had many storage problems - have you? Ali 12:10 [Comment From Mike] What is the best way to get a light and open texture from wholemeal bread flour in a breadmaker? Mine always seems a bit dense. 12:10: Patrick Moore: Hi Mike, the ratio of water to flour will help open the texture-try adding a couple of Grammes extra - the addition of a whole egg will also help open and soften the crumb-hope this helps! 12:13 [Comment From Brian Saunders] Yes 12:14 [Comment From Mike] Sorry Patrick, was that extra water or flour? 12:14: Patrick Moore: Sorry Mike-extra water or a little milk. Some wholemeal flours have a high absorbtion rate and need extra. 12:16: Lisa Galliers - Which?: Hi Brian, we were just discussing this. The yeast dispenser is a good idea if it works; adding the yeast towards the end will mean it won't be activated too early, however it will depend on other factors on the breadmaker, such as the dough temperature and at what point the yeast is actually added. We can't wait to see the results from this machine. We're testing it shortly. 12:16 [Comment From Colin] I'm too impatient to use the long program on my machine, and always stick to the short program, which seems to produce decent enough results. Is the long program that much better (yes, I know I should just try it and see) 12:16: Ali Eastwood - Which?: hi Colin Good question! We've done lots of lab testing on this and our results show that a bit of patience goes a long way. Lots of machines have rapid bake programs but they're usually not as good as the main, full-length program. The current Panasonic Best Buy model has a slightly longer rapid bake program of just under 2 hours and this has given some good results. Longer programs are generally better I'm afraid. Ali 12:16: [Comment From Mike] Thanks Patrick. 12:18: [Comment From Brian Saunders] Hi Ali. Just use commercial bread at the moment but that works fine in a plastic bag put in the fridge. 12:19: Kelly Fenn - Which?: Hi - you may also have noticed that you can follow us live on camera - just scroll to the bottom of the page and click on the play button. 12:20: Kelly Fenn - Which?: As you'll see we have a selection of breadmakers up and running and baking as we speak! We'll show you the results a little later. 12:20 [Comment From jan broom] Gluten Free Breadmaking, how good is the breadmaker for this?

12:20 [Comment From Nigel] After my bread is completed in the breadmaker it continues to develop for a couple of hours, becoming firmer and more tasty. What is happening during that time. It doesnt seem to be nearly so extreme for bread baked in the oven. I use a Panasonic SD255 breadmaker on wholemeal setting. 12:20: Patrick Moore: Hi Nigel, All bread improves with age - the term stale to some means mature or vintage to others. The key is to find when the bread is at its best for you- all flours have an optimum shelf life after baking and it is usually close to this that the flavour is at its best. 12:20 Lisa Galliers - Which?: Hi Jan, we don't test the breadmakers for gluten-free breadmaking, but most breadmakers have a setting for this, which we do mention in the reviews as we know this is important to many. It may be something which we will cover in the future, in our testing. 12:23 [Comment From Colin] My machine beeps at about 20 mins into the program to tell me to add any fruit or nuts or whatever to the mix. I can't be bothered with this and just add them at the beginning with all the other ingredients. It seems to work Ok so why the implication that you should wait until later in the program? 12:23: Ali Eastwood - Which?: hi Colin, most manufacturers recommend waiting for the signal before adding fruit etc as, if you put it in at the start, it might get mashed up too much in the initial mixing phases. It depends how worried you are about your raisins etc staying intact: they'll always break up a little in the process but waiting for the beep might just help more of them survive. Ali 12:23 [Comment From Peter] We have an early Panasonic breadmaker with a limited number of options - basic, wholewheat, multi grain, pizza and bake. It works well with all standard bread flours but has given poor results with a simple packet sun flower seed flour. What baking option would be the most suitable to use or should I stick with the basic flour types and avoid the pre-made?. 12:23: Lisa Galliers - Which?: Hi Peter, I would suggest using the basic setting for a seeded packet mix or the rapid bake, if your breadmaker has that setting? 12:24 [Comment From Linda Smith Linda Smith] Hi. I have just bought a Panasonic 256 breadmaker. I have to have wheat-free bread but no matter how well I follow the recipe/instructions, it doesn't produce a decent loaf. I have tried 3 times using different recipes and the results are greasy, wet, flat and unappetising - disastrous! What am I doing wrong? 12:25 [Comment From Colin] Thanks for the answer - the short bake on my machine (old Russell Hobbs) is about 2 and a quarter hours so still longer than the Panasonic, but the full program is 3 and a half to 4 hours, so maybe I'll give it a go. 12:25 [Comment From Elaine ] How do I keep a crisp crust on my bread ? After leaving it to cool the crust looses its crispness. 12:25: Patrick Moore: Keeping that fresh crust is easier on a nice sunny day but the crust absorbs moisture from the atmosphere so we have issues in the lakes keeping our crusts on a rainy day! keep it in a dry atmosphere as long as possible!

12:25: Lisa Galliers - Which?: Hi Linda, we'll looking into this for you and give you some advice shortly. 12:27: Patrick Moore: Hi Linda, which flour are you using? 12:27 [Comment From Mark] Hi, I find bread mixes really easy and quick to use, is there a way to make good interesting bread from a bread mix but by adding extra ingredients to the dispenser tray? 12:27: Ali Eastwood - Which?: Hi Mark There's a great range of bread mixes around, isn't there? The simple answer is yes: it's fine to add extra ingredients. It's really a question of trial and error: don't go too mad with quantities as it might spoil the balance of your loaf but there's no reason why you shouldn't give it a go. We're intrigued - what kind of things do you have in mind? Ali 12:29 [Comment From Elaine ] Thank you Patrick. 12:30: Ali Eastwood - Which?: hi everyone Lots of questions about crisp textures and french bread: Patrick is going to post shortly on this! Ali 12:30 [Comment From Sam ] Hi, I have the Panasonic SD255 and until recently it has always delivered superb results. The last half dozen times I've tried to make white bread on the long programme it just hasn't risen well. I've tried new yeast but this has only given a partial improvement. Do you have any other suggestions that I can try? 12:30: Lisa Galliers - Which?: Hi Sam, have you used anything else different in your recipes? Does the breadmaker seem to be heating up ok otherwise? 12:31 [Comment From Mike ] Will the text from this chat be available for viewing or download after the event has finished? 12:31: Kelly Fenn - Which?: Hi Mike - yes we'll be adding a PDF transcript of all of today's questions and answers, if you just check back at this page later. Thanks 12:32: Ali Eastwood - Which?: And, even more excitingly, Lisa's going to step away from the laptop for a few minutes to start baking some bread in the 3 breadmakers we have sitting next to us. Sadly, we can't offer you smellovision but you should be able to watch progress on our live video feed. 12:33 [Comment From Peter ] 2nd question. I have not managed to replicate the texture and taste of french bread from France. I have used extra strong white flour but the result has never matched the quality of the "real thing". Any suggestions? 12:33: Patrick Moore: Hi Nick, french bread is often made using french flour type 55 or type 65-this is a finer graded flour than the usual UK flours-try Shipton Mills online shop for french style flour or Swim the channel! 12:34: Kelly Fenn - Which?: Wow - you're certainly keeping our experts busy this afternoon. Please be patient while we plough through your questions!
12:36 [Comment From Mark] Thanks, Ali. I'm thinking of adding dried tomato, nuts, raisins etc. But I was wondering if you can do this on the rapid bake which works well with bread mixes on my Panasonic. I might try bunging it all in at the beginning as Colin does. So for instance I'd get the basic wholemeal bread mix and like to add walnuts, would it work if I chuck all the ingredients in at the beginning? 12:36: Ali Eastwood - Which?: hi Mark That sounds lovely. Give it a try. The worst that could happen was that your extra ingredients could get mashed up a bit - it shouldn't interfere with the rest of the baking process. Ali 12:37 [Comment From Caroline] I don't own a breadmaker but am thinking of buying the Panasonic best buy. I've just read here there is a new one coming out with yeast dispenser, should I wait for that one? Also can you make good spelt bread in a breadmaker? 12:37: Lewis Skinner - Which?: Hi Caroline, we were actually discussing the new Panasonic earlier - if you scroll down you can see a bit of information from Lisa at 12.16. You can also check out our 'Coming soon' review on this here - http://www.which.co.uk/home-andgarden/kitchen/reviews/breadmakers/panasonic-sdzb-2502/review/. Yes, you can make good spelt bread in a breadmaker but be sure to purchase a breadmaker with a spelt setting. Is this something you would like to see in the Which? reviews? 12:38 [Comment From Linda Smith] Hi Patrick, I am using a mixture of soya, potato and rice flour. 12:38: Patrick Moore: Differing flours have different absorption rates- as with any flour experimentation on +/- with water is needed-if all else fails begin with a ready mixed gluten free bread flour such as doves farm. POLL: Have you ever tried baking bread with any of the following flours? > > > > > Spelt ( 20% ) Rye ( 40% ) Kammut ( 0% ) Wheat ( 0% ) Mixture ( 40% )

12:40 [Comment From Peter] Patrick - re keeping the bread crust crisp. We keep that part of the loaf that is not immediately required in the freezer. When required place in the oven at around 100 and in 5 mins or so you have a crusty loaf. 12:40: Patrick Moore: Great technique-we do a lot of farmers markets and events and advise people to "refresh" the bread in this way also. Thanks for the input 12:42 [Comment From Caroline] Hi Lewis, yes I'd definitely like to see this in the Which reviews. 12:43: Ali Eastwood - Which?: Lots of chugging noises going on in the background here at Which? HQ as the breadmakers get on with their tasks. It's really interesting listening to the different noise levels and types of noise. Check out our First Look video review of the Kenwood BM260 to see what a noisy breadmaker can sound like. http://www.which.co.uk/home-and-garden/kitchen/reviews-ns/breadmaker-videoreviews/kenwood-bm260-breadmaker/ Ali
12:44 [Comment From Colin] How soon after baking can you put the loaf in a plastic bag? I was always under the impression that bread would go mouldy if it was bagged warm, so let mine cool completely. 12:44: Lisa Galliers - Which?: Hi Colin, we would suggest waiting about an hour for white bread to cool down and longer for brown bread, but at least until it's at room temperature, before putting it in a plastic bag - otherwise it will go soggy. 12:45 [Comment From Nick] Hello, everyone. I bought a Morphy Richards 48368 last year, a best buy, but I felt for the first time that the Which Best Buy tag was a con, as it wasn't anything like as good as the Kenwood I had before. Anyway, my question is how to get a proper French texture and crust in breadmaker bread. Might not manage it with this breadmaker, but maybe with the next one. 12:45 [Comment From Mike] Another one for you Patrick, can you suggest what flour to use to get the best 'french style' bread? 12:46: Kelly Fenn - Which?: Lots of questions around French textures and crusts coming through - if you scroll up to Patrick's response at 12.33 hopefully this should help! 12:46 [Comment From Peter] Patrick - When I spoke to a french baker in France he suggested it was likely to be due to the type of yeast used. We use fast acting dry yeast. Do you think this has any relevance? 12:46 Patrick Moore: Hi Peter, When I was last in Lenotre in Paris they used the same fresh bakers yeast strains as myself - we also produce a lot of French style Rustic baguettes ETC and we have excellent results-this is the same fresh yeast widely available in supermarkets.Dry yeast will provide a similiar result. It is all in the flour! 12:48 [Comment From Sam] Hi Lisa, nothing different that I'm aware of and I haven't noticed any problems with heating. 12:48: Lisa Galliers - Which?: Thanks Sam, that's very weird! What flour are you using? 12:49 [Comment From Peter] Thanks Patrick - next time I am over in France I will tell the baker!!! 12:53 [Comment From Caroline] Can you make sourdough bread in breadmakers? 12:53: Patrick Moore: Hi Caroline - we breathe sourdough at the bakery. The issue with bread makers is they work on the basis of fast acting dried yeast which takes little time to develop-sourdough 18-24 hours to develop. I would like to develop a breadmaker that has a long ferment setting that works-watch this space! POLL: How often on average do you use your breadmaker? > > > > > > Every day ( 7% ) 2-3 times a week ( 40% ) Once a week ( 20% ) Once a month ( 20% ) Once every 6 months ( 7% ) Rarely ( 7% )

12:54: Lewis Skinner - Which?: Hi all. Is there anything which you think is missing on the current range of breadmakers available which would make your baking lives easier? Any programmes/settings which you don't use at all? Also, it would be great to hear what your favourite recipes are? Thanks! 12:57 [Comment From Colin] There was a comment a while back in Which about how hard it was to get a good loaf from a bread machine without using salt. I'm trying to live a salt reduced life and put very little (maybe half a tsp) into my bread and it seems to be OK. What's the importance of the salt? 12:57: Lisa Galliers - Which?: Hi Colin, salt slows the yeast down, so it doesn't activate too early. A lack of of salt in the recipe may mean that it will prove too early and the loaf could collapse before the end of the program. However, many of our members do make bread without salt, but it can be a trial and error process until you find a recipe that suits you. And, of course, some people like the taste of salt in their bread. 12:59 [Comment From Sam] Hi Lisa, Hovis Super Strong Premium White bread flour 12:59: Lisa Galliers - Which?: Hi Sam, thanks for the info. Have you moved your breadmaker to a new position, or is it in a particularly warm or humid spot? 12:59 [Comment From Peter] Re french bread crust - would you recommend just using the dough programme and baking separately in the oven, rather than baking in the machine? 12:59: Patrick Moore: Yes, the oven will provide a superior crust-also if you use a clean garden sprayer to mist the oven with water just before baking this will help achieve fantastic crust as will baking on a stone pre-heated in the oven. 1:02 [Comment From Nigel] Patrick says it's all in the flour. Will Which consider reviewing bread flours. I know it's a personal thing but a discussion of the pros and cons of the normal big brands as well as a few artisan flours might be a good guide to help experimentation. 1:02 Ali Eastwood - Which?: hi Nigel, We don't have any plans to test bread flours at the moment but that's an interesting idea and something we could conceivably squeeze into a future lab test. Leave it with us, we'll give it some further thought. Have other people experimented with different flours? Tell us your experiences - have you suddenly transformed your breadmaking by a small change in ingredients? 1:03 [Comment From Peter] Patrick - many thanks sounds like a great idea. 1:05 [Comment From Guest] I make bread with a breadmaker using just flour, yeast, a little salt, a little sugar, and water. White loaves are perfect, whereas wholemeal is sometime sticky to the touch (and the knife), and often the crumb is too coarse and crumbly. I do vary the amount of water sometimes, but it doesn't have much of an effect. Any suggestions? 1:05: Patrick Moore: Hi, Try adding a whole egg to Wholemeal this will help set the crumb.It could also be too much water as you mention-also wholemeal bread takes much longer to cool than white-are you leaving it to cool completely before slicing. Crumbly texture could be weak flour! try a new brand!

1:05 [Comment From Steve Timms] We bought our breadmaker in a Belgian supermaket 12 years ago for about 15 and it is still going strong but we lost the handbook in a move. It is manufactured by SMC and is model BA-15 but we cannot find details on the internet. Any ideas how we can find a replacement handbook please? 1:05: Lewis Skinner - Which?: Hi Steve, unfortunately we are not too sure about this model. What we would like to do is speak to our friends over in the Belgium consumer association to see if they have any ideas where we can pick up a handbook. If you could send as much information on the product you have to live@which.co.uk then we will pick it up after this Q&A. 1:06 [Comment From Nigel] I almost always use the WholeMeal setting. I never use Basic, Italian, Sandwich, Gluten free or Pizza. Would love a sourdough setting. I have a Panasonic SD255. 1:09 [Comment From Sam] Hi Lisa, I haven't moved the machine; would I be wise to just try some different flours? The supermarkets are limited but I can always order online, any suggestions? 1:09: Lisa Galliers - Which?: Hi Sam, yes, it would be worth trying a different flour if everything else seems to be in working order. Patrick, our bread expert, has given some suggestions earlier here, on what flours to use and where to get them from. Some can be ordered online, too. Hope that helps! 1:10 [Comment From Nigel] Flours. I aim for the healthiest, tastiest loaf with a good texture. I found just wholemeal a bit too gritty but adding about 30% malted flour gives a nice chewy texture - I use Waitrose Malted or sometimes Hovis Granary. If I get it I include about 10% Allinson Wholemeal Seed and Grain Bread Flour. This wholemeal version is not easy to obtain. 1:12 [Comment From Caroline] Thanks Patrick, how long do I have to watch for! 1:12: Patrick Moore: It might be a little while! 1:12 [Comment From Peter] I particularly enjoy crusty bread. Which machines would you recommend for this and how would you treat comercial bread to improve its crust 1:12: Ali Eastwood - Which?: hi Peter Sorry for the delay in responding to your question about which machines give the best crust. We baked some bread with Patrick recently in the Best Buy Panasonic SD 257 and he was impressed with the crust it produced so that might be a good machine for you? Ali 1:13: Kelly Fenn - Which?: Around 20 mins until our first batch of bread is ready, Lisa tells me! Looking forward to seeing (and tasting) the results :-) 1:17 [Comment From Peter] For french bread - flour, yeast, salt & water or would you add sugar and any fat? 1:17: Patrick Moore: Hi Peter, the best french bread is simple just flour, salt, water and yeast. 1:18 [Comment From Linda] Desperate for sourdough bread machine. given up my breadmaking on my panasonic because fermentation time to short. Any suggestions?

1:18: Lisa Galliers - Which?: Hi Linda, there are some breadmakers available where you can set your own recipe and timings, however breadmakers generally won't alter the temperature, which is the problem as sourdough needs a temp of around 12 - 16c to develop, because with long fermentation it's not just proving, it's developing the flavour as well. 1:18 [Comment From franco] re comment by sam on the panasonic 255 - bread not rising after last 6 bakes. 1:19: Kelly Fenn - Which?: Hi Franco - would you be able to resend your question / comment please? We only received half of it! 1:19 [Comment From Colin] Regarding flours and programs, I have tried many of the commercial flours and don't find much difference between them. I tend to use a half and half mixture of whatever white and brown that I have at the time, plus any extras that take my fancy (eg. parmesan, pesto, tomato puree, mixed seeds), and I always use program 1 (basic white) regardless. 1:22: Ali Eastwood - Which?: hi We've just had call asking whether breadmakers can make bread with potato or rice flour. The answer is yes: essentially these are gluten-free flours so it's just a question of carefully following the recipe. Most machines have gluten-free recipes nowadays but, if not, try searching online or contacting the manufacturer for a recipe that will work in your machine. Ali 1:23 [Comment From franco] re sams comment at 12.30pm about herbread not rising after the last 6 bakes. we had the very similar panasonic 253 that did the same. thought it was the ingredients, but it turned out to be the machine. this was proved using our daughters identical machine. we now have the panasonic 256 that bakes perfect loaves on the long cycle. interesting panasonic have increased the yeast content from our last machine 1:27: Patrick Moore: Hi Sam Re flour type- have you tried Carrs breadmaker range or Shipton mill have an online shop and a great range of flour delivered to your door! 1:27: Lisa Galliers - Which?: Hi Franco, breadmaker manufacturers do tweak their recipes from time to time. Sometimes it's the ingredients, and sometimes the actual timings are changed slightly. 1:28 [Comment From Joel] Hi, we have the Panasonic sd235 and would like to start using the Gluten free program. Any tips, we'd like to avoid mixes with artifical ingredients as much as possible. thanks Joel ps off to pick up kids so may not be online when you reply but will check the pdf of the report. 1:28: Kelly Fenn - Which?: Thanks Joel - Lisa's just coming back with an answer to this one. 1:29: Ali Eastwood - Which?: Couldn't resist just having a quick peek at the breadmakers. Two of the machines we're trying out live have viewing windows so you can see how things are progressing but the Panasonic model doesn't. This is true of all the Panasonic range, including its latest launch. Seems a shame to me: the smell is so enticing it's a really natural response to want to have a wee look to see the loaf developing. It makes no difference to the quality of the bread but, as traditional breadmaking is so interactive and using a breadmaker is so hands-off, I think it's a pity you can't see what's going on. I guess the novelty wears off after a while. What do you think? Ali

1:29: Lisa Galliers - Which?: regarding the gluten free questions, the gluten-free setting isn't something we test at the moment, but may be something we look into for the future would this be of interest ? 1:31 [Comment From Liz] Gluten free testing would be very useful. 1:32 [Comment From Nigel] We've heard this morning what salt does. But what does butter do? And sugar? and what is the effect of increasing or decreasing these or substuting something else like milk? 1:32: Patrick Moore: Butter enriches and provides great crumb and crust colour whilst assisting flavour and extending shelf life, sugar also improves crumb and crust flavour and colour while providing a valuable food source for yeast, milk will also soften the crumb and help with the caramelisation of the crust-try adding at various levels to achieve the crust and crumb you desire. 1:36: Kelly Fenn - Which?: Our first batch of bread is apparently nearing complete! Baked in the Kenwood BM450 breadmaker, which scored a decent 66% in our tests. We're using the Rapid bake setting for the purposes of our short time online today, but we generally don't see the best results with this setting - and no longer test on this type of program. 1:36 [Comment From jan broom] yes would like you to do a whole section on gluten free foods, all of the different foods available to purchase too. They are expensive, especially the bread!! 1:38: Kelly Fenn - Which?: Just to say we're over an hour-and-a-half into our Q&A today, so do keep your questions coming. We're here today until 2.30pm. 1:38: Ali Eastwood - Which?: Thanks for all the questions so far, you're keeping us busy and giving us lots of (ahem) food for thought. We've had some email questions and comments too, including one from George who told us he's been using the same Panasonic model for 20 years! Impressive stuff - and tallies with the findings of Which?'s small appliance reliability survey where Panasonic had a reliability score of 95%: the best of all brands featured. You can find more information about brand reliability on our website: http://www.which.co.uk/home-andgarden/kitchen/reviews/breadmakers/page/reliability/ 1:44: Kelly Fenn - Which?: Hi everyone - for anyone that didn't realise, we're also live on video if you wanted to follow us that way. Look out for the grand bread unveiling soon! All you need to do is scroll down the page and click on the 'play' button. 1:46 [Comment From Colin] Any tips for cleaning the viewing window? Mine is now virtually opaque and doesn't want to come clean. 1:46: Lewis Skinner - Which?: Hi Colin, in our experience a damp cloths usually works best. What have you tried so far? Does anyone else have any breadmaker cleaning hints/ tips? 1:48: Kelly Fenn - Which?: And please do post us your top breadmaking recipes! 1:50 [Comment From Nigel] Keeping the breadmaker clean. Best tip from me would be to remove the bin from the breadmaker before adding the flour. I didn't always do this and however careful you are you will spill some flour

1:50: Lisa Galliers - Which?: We would always recommend that the bread pan is removed before the ingredients are added, as the inside of the breadmaker can be tricky to clean. 1:52 [Comment From Guest] I have seen some breadmakers use a paddle to mix the ingredients, which leave a void in the centre of the bread. Do the newer models still have this problem? 1:54: Lisa Galliers - Which?: All breadmakers use a paddle to mix ingredients, and they will leave a small hole in the loaf, this is unavoidable unfortunately! However, some models do leave a smaller hole than others, and we do comment in reviews if a bread maker leaves an exceptionally large hole in the bottom of the load. Newer models do suffer from this problem, even ones with the paddle which folds down. 1:54: Ali Eastwood - Which?: If you're following the video feed you might spotted the emergence of a quite uneven-looking loaf from one of our machines. It's the fast-bake loaf and early impressions are that it's not looking too great. We're letting it cool and will investigate further once the other loaves are out. 1:55: Patrick Moore: As a real bread baker I love to try other breads both fom professionals and amateurs-I usually learn something i had not considered-has anyone tried or bought a loaf that might equal their own creations? 1:57: Kelly Fenn - Which?: If you're keen on trying out lots of different real breads, this tool - run by the Real Bread Campaign http://www.sustainweb.org/realbread/bakery_finder/ - is worth a look. Type in your postcode to find your nearest real bread outlets. 1:57 [Comment From Colin] It's well beyond the damp cloth stage, wondering whether something a bit more powerful would be Ok, like oven door cleaner? 1:57: Lewis Skinner - Which?: Hi Colin, oh dear - we would always recommend that the viewing window is cleaned immediately after use. In your case I think it would be unwise to use oven door cleaner, abrasive sponges or generic cleaners as this can damage the nonstick coating in the machine. If the lid is removable it may be an idea to soak it in water for a period of time. 2:00: Kelly Fenn - Which?: And a shameless Which? plug here - if you're currently in the market for a new breadmaker our video First Look reviews are worth a watch, covering some of the newest models on the market: http://www.which.co.uk/home-andgarden/kitchen/reviews-ns/breadmaker-video-reviews/ POLL: What time of day do you tend to use your breadmaker? > > > > Morning ( 38% ) Afternoon ( 13% ) Evening ( 13% ) Overnight ( 38% )

2:03 [Comment From Colin] Any tips on getting a 'cut' or 'cross' opening on the top of the crust - I'm always fearful of opening the machine once the dough is rising to attempt it.
2:03: Patrick Moore: Hi Colin, I would not recommend "slashing" the dough before baking using a breadmaker-the cut could allow the loaf to expand further and could rise beyond the machines capacity-however great they may look! 2:04: Kelly Fenn - Which?: Early warning guys - just under half an hour to go, so please keep your questions coming in so our experts can get round to them in time! 2:04 [Comment From John ] When the machine is used daily (large family), I find that the paddle bearing wears rapidly after about a year with two different machines I've tried so far. Manufacturers don't seem too bothered about this (I suppose they're in business to sell as many products as possible), but I find this annoyingly expensive, and I would have expected such a product to have a much longer life span. Is this type of failure to be expected of all machines? There is no mention of the life expectancy in any literature, nor any information regarding maintenance or replacement of such a minor part, the failure of which renders the whole machine unusable. 2:04: Lisa Galliers - Which?: Hi John, thanks for your comments, which breadmaker do you have? in our reliability survey, our members told us that on average their breadmakers lasted 8 years, but genreally people don't use them on a daily basis, most of our members use them on a weekly basis. We've just added reliability to our breadmaker reviews. If you'd like to email us on live@which.co.uk with more details, this is something we can ask the manufacturers for you. 2:05 [Comment From Colin] I love trying different loaves from the specialist bakers at local farmers markers if only to get a different shape from the standard bread machine brick. Our local village baker does a lovely oily, herby Turkish flatbread which I am just about to have for my lunch! 2:07: Kelly Fenn - Which?: Take a look at the results from the Panasonic SD-257 rapid bake program on our live video stream! Scroll down and click on the play button. 2:07: Kelly Fenn - Which?: This one is looking the best of the bunch. 2:08: Kelly Fenn - Which?: Next up - the Morphy Richards-baked bead 2:08: Kelly Fenn - Which?: From the Morphy Richards 48322 breadmaker. 2:10: Kelly Fenn - Which?: It's a Best Buy model, but we know from previous tests that the fastbake 1 setting doesn't yield great results. That looks to be the case today too. 2:11: Kelly Fenn - Which?: The Panasonic rapid bake setting takes 1hr and 55mins, compared with the Morphy's 1hr 10mins. You can really see the difference!! 2:11: Kelly Fenn - Which?: Next, the Kenwood offering. 2:12: Kelly Fenn - Which?: This rapid bake setting takes just 58mins. It's browned around the sides with a pale crown - and the crust has blown. 2:13: Kelly Fenn - Which?: This is the Kenwood next to the Panasonic. 2:14: Kelly Fenn - Which?: And here's the Kenwood vs Morphy breads.

2:15 Ali Eastwood - Which?: Off to get a knife so we can show you what the bread looks like inside. 2:16: Patrick Moore: The Kenwood and Morphy Richards both have blown, pale crowns-this is due to being baked whilst still green (underproved)-rapid bake setting not good for even crust colour or texture! Much less so on the Panasonic. 2:17: Lisa Galliers - Which?: Ok, my favourite part, we've just got the bread out of the breadmakers. We've baked using the fast setting, as we've already explained above, the loaves do look different, but I think this demonstrates quite nicely that the longer the 'rapid bake' setting is, the better the results. 2:17 [Comment From Liz] the web site posted at 1.57 is worth checking out for where to purchase real bread. 2:18: Ali Eastwood - Which?: Lisa's going to show the bottom of each loaf and then cut the loaves open now so you can see the impact of the paddle: you can see some have bigger holes where the paddle was. 2:19: Ali Eastwood - Which?: The Kenwood coming to the camera right now. big hole where the paddle was! 2:20 Ali Eastwood - Which?: Morphy Richards now: still a hole but a different type. 2:21: Ali Eastwood - Which?: Panasonic - this loaf made a lovely crunch when Lisa sliced it. And it has a much smaller hole: less paddle damage 2:23: Kelly Fenn - Which?: So it looks like the Panasonic is the winner - again! 2:24: Lewis Skinner - Which?: Just over 5 mins left of this Q&A so please let us know if you have any final questions? 2:25: Ali Eastwood - Which?: Thank you Elaine. We're dying to go eat that bread we just baked! 2:26 [Comment From Elaine] Thankyou all for a very enlightening Q&A session. 2:26: Lisa Galliers - Which?: Does anyone have any ideas or thoughts on what they'd like to see in the next breadmakers article? Please let us know by emailing live@which.co.uk 2:27 [Comment From Nigel] Thank you - useful. 2:27 [Comment From Guest] Thanks all. It is great to have a real live event and not a sales demo. 2:28 [Comment From Liz] Thanks, Info re flour providers and general advice is much appreciated 2:28 [Comment From Elaine] Perhaps you should report on the taste test! 2:28 [Comment From Peter] I think Panasonic have been the "leaders" in breadmakers since they were first introduced so no surprise with your results.
2:29: Patrick Moore: Thank you all for your kind words. I have enjoyed today greatly. 2:29: Lisa Galliers - Which?: Thanks Peter, Panasonic breadmakers have performed consistently in our tests since we've been testing them, but this is a good opportunity to show you the differences. 2:29 [Comment From Colin] Thanks all - very informative, should do more of these. 2:29 [Comment From Peter] Excellent Q&A Congratulations 2:29: Kelly Fenn - Which?: Remember if you're keen on debating breadmaking techniques head over to Which? Conversation: http://conversation.which.co.uk/energyhome/breadmakers-baking-bread-best-since-sliced-bread/ 2:30: Lewis Skinner - Which?: Thanks for all queries throughout this Q&A, hope you enjoy the next breadmaker article! Lewis 2:31: Lisa Galliers - Which?: and if you love your breadmaker then please visit our breadmaker reviews, and leave us comments on your model (in the customer views tab) and watch out for our next batch of results. The breadmakers are in the lab at the moment - including the new fan-assisted Kenwoods and the new Panasonic models, so these will be published online as soon as possible. 2:32: Kelly Fenn - Which?: That's it for today folks - thanks for all your great questions. You can head to www.which.co.uk/live for details of other live events we run on the website. 2:33: Kelly Fenn - Which?: Bye!